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> Hello from David Allen, Hello from the Creator of Mordor
Jmainguy
post Jan 4 2011, 06:57 PM
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Wow this is awesome, Thank you for creating this great game David, I too started playing it on a shareware cd from the 90's and have thought of this game many times since then.
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DavidAllen
post Jan 4 2011, 07:16 PM
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QUOTE (grobblewobble @ Jan 3 2011, 01:15 PM) *
Thanks for the clarification, but I didn't mean to ask about the artist. Rather, the picture is somewhat of a mystery because you can edit a monster to look like this, but there are no monsters like that in the game. So what I meant to ask was: do you remember what kind of monster it was intented for?


I want to say it was for an end-game boss mob, but I cannot remember. Sorry.

QUOTE (rb8f @ Jan 3 2011, 01:40 PM) *
ah, i have a couple of questions, very mordor based,
Dalyn's smile. is that a contracton of David Allen?
and, on level two, are there two letters, D and A. is that a coincidence?

another question. on your requnix site, you have a picture of the mordor II 0.95b. is there, by any chance i could get my hands on a copy, because that looks like a big fat mod for mordor 1, just by looking at the picture and the similarities of level two, indicated on the map. i don't like too much the "three dee" concept of modor, but thats just my opinion. happy.gif


Unfortunately I don't have Mordor 2 0.95b. I took the picture from another website. The only official memorabilia I have of Mordor is an original unopened box copy which I plan on keeping around for awhile smile.gif

QUOTE (aardless @ Jan 4 2011, 07:14 AM) *
Welcome David!!!! wave.gif It's an honour to meet another David (as in: I'm a David too) who had such an impact on my life.

What I'd like to ask is: do you have pointers on formula making for game balancing? And was the T'Mana (and Shadow Ninja and Turtle Dragon) really intended to be found in-game? The description in Mordor 2 for one of those, I forget which one, states that they are extinct. I do realise it's been around 15 years now and that you can't probably remember every little detail, but hopefully you do remember it.


Honestly I cannot remember. Shadow Ninja and Turtle Dragon are very familiar, but I cannot remember whether or not they were to be included.

Sorry I haven't been more helpful in these questions. I don't think I've played Mordor since 1996.


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David Allen
Creator of Mordor, Demise, Horizons and Alganon
http://www.requnix.com
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grobblewobble
post Jan 4 2011, 07:37 PM
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No problem at all! It is great to hear the answers from the prime source, even if that answer is "don't know".

For kicks and giggles, did you know about the secret city of Vespa? It is a hidden feature of Mordor. wink.gif

http://mordor.uni.cc/forum/index.php?s=&am...ost&p=17570


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Danjen
post Jan 4 2011, 09:42 PM
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Ooh, I got another question, too.

When you were making Mordor 2, did you start the coding over from scratch, or did you just heavily modify the Mordor 1 engine until it was what it was?
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korexus
post Jan 5 2011, 09:17 PM
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Wow, this opportunity is too good to miss.

A couple of years ago I started making a web based RPG which drew heavily on the original Mordor game for inspiration. (I also used this site to help me find lots of details about weapons, spells and items, thanks for that!) That project fizzled out at the time, but over the recent Christmas break I remembered it, revisited the code and got a basic version up and running. - I have no intention of detracting from Mordor XP, so won't post a link here, but if anyone is interested in play testing my meager attempt, please do contact me.

Anyway, it would be good to know if there are any aspects of the original game I should stay away from? I've re-written the combat system and am using a randomly generated map, but the item, spell and monster names and stats (and perhaps most importantly the monster pictures) are pretty much lifted from the original Mordor. The game, if it is ever finished, would be freely available for play online and is not intended for making profit, but I would hate to tread on any copyrighted toes, especially with a game which I've spent so long playing and enjoying!

Thanks,
korexus.
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DavidAllen
post Jan 6 2011, 06:00 AM
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QUOTE (Danjen @ Jan 4 2011, 01:42 PM) *
Ooh, I got another question, too.

When you were making Mordor 2, did you start the coding over from scratch, or did you just heavily modify the Mordor 1 engine until it was what it was?


I modified the Mordor 1 engine. If I recall Mordor 1 was written in VB4 and I converted it to VB6 for Mordor 2. Or was it VB5? I can't remember smile.gif

QUOTE (korexus @ Jan 5 2011, 01:17 PM) *
Wow, this opportunity is too good to miss.

A couple of years ago I started making a web based RPG which drew heavily on the original Mordor game for inspiration. (I also used this site to help me find lots of details about weapons, spells and items, thanks for that!) That project fizzled out at the time, but over the recent Christmas break I remembered it, revisited the code and got a basic version up and running. - I have no intention of detracting from Mordor XP, so won't post a link here, but if anyone is interested in play testing my meager attempt, please do contact me.

Anyway, it would be good to know if there are any aspects of the original game I should stay away from? I've re-written the combat system and am using a randomly generated map, but the item, spell and monster names and stats (and perhaps most importantly the monster pictures) are pretty much lifted from the original Mordor. The game, if it is ever finished, would be freely available for play online and is not intended for making profit, but I would hate to tread on any copyrighted toes, especially with a game which I've spent so long playing and enjoying!

Thanks,
korexus.


If Braindead doesn't have an issue, I don't see a problem with posting it here.

I say go for it. While I do own the Mordor IP (for the game), I never made any real money from it and if I did I'm sure the Tolkien family would be knocking on my door. When I came up with the name I was 19 years old and knew next to nothing about copyright law.

So do what you love and love what you do and make your own personal project - if you write all your own code and systems, there's nothing wrong with making references to the things you love.

Remember, the best developers out there all became so through their personal projects. Have at it!

This post has been edited by DavidAllen: Jan 6 2011, 06:00 AM


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David Allen
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Danjen
post Jan 6 2011, 06:25 AM
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To be fair, I believe Mordor is Gaelic for "dark land", so it's technically okay to use it.

I'm sure their lawyers disagree though tongue.gif
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rb10c
post Jan 6 2011, 06:48 AM
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its kinda ridiculous though. i mean, you cant copyright a name, can you? a unique name, such as tengu or dejenol (unless they are real words) fair enough, but it has no association with mordor. it simply is a derivative of the meaning.
oh well.


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mordor, my favourite game EVER!!

QUOTE (rb10c @ Feb 14 2011, 03:22 PM) *
Darn, I went off-topic on an off-topic topic. Who's going to go off topic on this off topic, off topic topic?
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korexus
post Jan 6 2011, 07:30 AM
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QUOTE (DavidAllen @ Jan 6 2011, 06:00 AM) *
If Braindead doesn't have an issue, I don't see a problem with posting it here.

I say go for it. While I do own the Mordor IP (for the game), I never made any real money from it and if I did I'm sure the Tolkien family would be knocking on my door. When I came up with the name I was 19 years old and knew next to nothing about copyright law.

So do what you love and love what you do and make your own personal project - if you write all your own code and systems, there's nothing wrong with making references to the things you love.

Remember, the best developers out there all became so through their personal projects. Have at it!


If Braindead doesn't have a problem, then I'll post a link. I know I'd be a bit annoyed if someone turned up at my site and started promoting their own game
without ever having done anything for the community, so I'll wait for an OK before doing anything like that... sleep.gif

To be clear, the game I'm playing with isn't Mordor, doesn't use the name Mordor and doesn't look much like Mordor so I'm happy that the project itself is legitimate. I have been feeling guilty about using the monster artwork without permission though...


Thanks!

korexus.
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Nudibranch
post Jan 6 2011, 08:25 AM
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QUOTE (DavidAllen @ Jan 6 2011, 01:00 AM) *
I say go for it. While I do own the Mordor IP (for the game), I never made any real money from it and if I did I'm sure the Tolkien family would be knocking on my door. When I came up with the name I was 19 years old and knew next to nothing about copyright law.

It's my understanding you sold the rights to the game, including the rights to the IP, to Decklin... can you shed some light on that?


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smiley
post Jan 6 2011, 11:06 AM
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QUOTE (Nudibranch @ Jan 6 2011, 09:25 AM) *
It's my understanding you sold the rights to the game, including the rights to the IP, to Decklin... can you shed some light on that?


Hi David, I loved playing mordor! still venture down in the depths from time to time.

I was just gonna ask if I could cameo a couple of mordor .Wav sounds in an upcomming iPhone game I'm working on, but I guess I have to get hold of someone else ?

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cybertim
post Jan 6 2011, 01:48 PM
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QUOTE (korexus @ Jan 6 2011, 08:30 AM) *
To be clear, the game I'm playing with isn't Mordor, doesn't use the name Mordor and doesn't look much like Mordor so I'm happy that the project itself is legitimate. I have been feeling guilty about using the monster artwork without permission though...


I was curious and did a simple google search to find your game.

It's indeed not (excatly) like mordor, only the artwork and the resistance-system shows similarity.
It's a nice webbased (no flash) game though!

Since i'm also trying to make a mordor-like game (based on) i found a lot of spin-offs, but most of them died early before something was really playable.
(I guess that i know why this is - the whole system looks simple (when you play the game) but trying to recreate it you'll notice how complex it is.)
MordorXP has the most potential even though i've never seen it in action smile.gif but i hope to be playing it very soon ok.gif so i can ditch my dosbox+windows31 for mordor1 smile.gif

So i was wondering, David, how long did it take to create the first Mordor?
I would guess more than 1 year spare-time development?
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DavidAllen
post Jan 6 2011, 07:59 PM
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QUOTE (Nudibranch @ Jan 6 2011, 12:25 AM) *
It's my understanding you sold the rights to the game, including the rights to the IP, to Decklin... can you shed some light on that?


I sold Demise to Decklin, but I don't recall selling Mordor to him. I suppose I may have, but honestly can't remember. Wow, it's amazing how the memory goes over time!

IMO it doesn't really matter since I don't have any Mordor-based plans for the future.


QUOTE (rb8f @ Jan 5 2011, 10:48 PM) *
its kinda ridiculous though. i mean, you cant copyright a name, can you? a unique name, such as tengu or dejenol (unless they are real words) fair enough, but it has no association with mordor. it simply is a derivative of the meaning.
oh well.


There are three forms of legal protection for work: Copyright, Trademark, and Patent.

Copyright, a form of intellectual property law, protects original works of authorship including literary, dramatic, musical, and artistic works, such as poetry, novels, movies, songs, computer software, and architecture. Copyright does not protect facts, ideas, systems, or methods of operation, although it may protect the way these things are expressed. Copyright protects original works of authorship, while a patent protects inventions or discoveries. Ideas and discoveries are not protected by the copyright law, although the way in which they are expressed may be. A trademark protects words, phrases, symbols, or designs identifying the source of the goods or services of one party and distinguishing them from those of others.

A trademark is used to protect a word, symbol, device, or name that is used for the purpose of trading goods. The trademark indicates the source of goods and distinguishes them from the goods of others. A trademark may also be used to prevent others from using a mark that might be confused with another; trademarks, however, do not prevent other people or businesses from producing the same product or services under a different mark.

A patent for an invention grants a property right to the inventor that will prevent anyone else from making, using, or selling an invention. A patent lasts for a limited amount of time, usually 20 years from the date the application was filed, and is only effective in the country in which it was filed. The application for a patent must include a detailed description of how the invention works. Since a patent is considered "property," it may be bought, sold, mortgaged, or licensed by the owner.

QUOTE (cybertim @ Jan 6 2011, 05:48 AM) *
I was curious and did a simple google search to find your game.

It's indeed not (excatly) like mordor, only the artwork and the resistance-system shows similarity.
It's a nice webbased (no flash) game though!

Since i'm also trying to make a mordor-like game (based on) i found a lot of spin-offs, but most of them died early before something was really playable.
(I guess that i know why this is - the whole system looks simple (when you play the game) but trying to recreate it you'll notice how complex it is.)
MordorXP has the most potential even though i've never seen it in action smile.gif but i hope to be playing it very soon ok.gif so i can ditch my dosbox+windows31 for mordor1 smile.gif

So i was wondering, David, how long did it take to create the first Mordor?
I would guess more than 1 year spare-time development?


I think a year sounds about right. I remember beginning to code Mordor at home when I lived in Georgia and worked for Microhelp. If I recall it was after I completed Wizardry VII: Crusaders of the Dark Savant. It would have been written in VB3 at that point. What took the longest was getting all of the data in and working. When I moved back to Washington and VB4 came out I converted it and finished it.

Hard to believe that was around 16 years ago...


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David Allen
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http://www.requnix.com
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Direnar
post Jan 6 2011, 08:22 PM
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David, are you currently involved in any project in the video game industry? Or IT in general?
Thanks for answering our questions!


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Decklin
post Jan 7 2011, 09:46 PM
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Greetings to all ... :-)

MakeItSo LLC Sold all DEMISE IP to Decklin - the DEMISE 'product' includes all source etc etc in its foundation games Mordor 1, Mordor 2, IW .. as they are an intrinsic part of the whole :-) [ Some VB4 still there David wink.gif ] Braindead has a written agreement which can be voided if the terms are breached by revealing ANY of the algorithms etc that are essentially still part of Demise ... and in fact there are supposed to be acknowledgements of the IP ownership and our permissions prominently on this site.

Just so noting, "for the record".

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korexus
post Jan 7 2011, 10:20 PM
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QUOTE (Decklin @ Jan 7 2011, 09:46 PM) *
Greetings to all ... :-)

MakeItSo LLC Sold all DEMISE IP to Decklin - the DEMISE 'product' includes all source etc etc in its foundation games Mordor 1, Mordor 2, IW .. as they are an intrinsic part of the whole :-) [ Some VB4 still there David wink.gif ] Braindead has a written agreement which can be voided if the terms are breached by revealing ANY of the algorithms etc that are essentially still part of Demise ... and in fact there are supposed to be acknowledgements of the IP ownership and our permissions prominently on this site.

Just so noting, "for the record".


Hi Decklin,

Does that mean I should give you a heads up about my project? As noted above I don't want to tread on any toes and will happily include links and acknowledgements or remove content as the people who could sue me prefer! What's the best way to get in contact with you?


Thanks,

korexus.
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Danjen
post Jan 8 2011, 02:08 AM
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Actually Decklin, that's a good point... I know there are a number of M1 (M2 probably, too) formulas on the wiki, which obviously aren't in use in Demise by that standard, but I'm wondering what exactly is still shared between the two games?
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cybertim
post Jan 8 2011, 11:15 AM
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QUOTE (korexus @ Jan 7 2011, 11:20 PM) *
Does that mean I should give you a heads up about my project? As noted above I don't want to tread on any toes and will happily include links and acknowledgements or remove content as the people who could sue me prefer! What's the best way to get in contact with you?


I got the same question, even though i'm only making a homage to Mordor and not calling it the 'new' mordor (like mordorXp) but giving it it's own name.

I'm also writing it from scratch without looking at the source/logaritms/calculations of the old VB mordor game, i'm going to balance it on my own - for learning purposes.
And i'm going to create my own universe (names/art).

But it is based on the gameplay of the old mordor game (as is mordor on avatar that i also played for a short while).

Does this still mean that you have to sit around the table with decklin or is this only limited to people that make use of the art/source(calculations/balance)/name of the old game?

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rb10c
post Jan 8 2011, 12:23 PM
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just a polite suggestion, why dont you try and join the dev. team? i'm sure some new people should get it done faster! though i think i remember seeing a "too many chefs" post somewhere. this kinda applies to both korexus and cybertim.


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mordor, my favourite game EVER!!

QUOTE (rb10c @ Feb 14 2011, 03:22 PM) *
Darn, I went off-topic on an off-topic topic. Who's going to go off topic on this off topic, off topic topic?
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korexus
post Jan 8 2011, 01:58 PM
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Unfortunately, I have no VB knowledge and no artistic ability, which is why the game I am writing is web based and uses the original Mordor images. I imagine that this makes me of limited usefulness to the MXP team. I am good at maths, and can go borderline obsessive on game design, so could help with creating algorithms and so on, but my understanding is that there isn't much need for that on this project...

If there's something I can do to help though, let me know. I certainly owe something to this site for all the spreadsheets and editors I downloaded when I started this project.


korexus.
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