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> Recording a Mordor run - solo good elf!
fischsemmel
post Jul 16 2019, 01:48 PM
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Iirc once I was on 11 with my osirri (and I have the same intentions for my human once he has a few more levels), I loved it. Pirahnas are annoying, so I just skip them. But otherwise I'd clear the lake and then fight my way through the white dragon, giant king, vampire on 9, and thr lake on 7 while waiting on 11 respawn. Probably visiting twisted elf and maybe goblin shaman&cockatrices too.

Hammerheads are a lot of xp, and even though there aren't many big groups, the water monsters on 11 are nice and safe and a lot higher level and hits than 7 stuff. I prefer not wandering through rooms randomly to level because of concern about running into nastier stuff... Lava Giants, phantasmal mists, mundragons, spellcaster groups, mythicals, ninjas. You may not need to worry about then as much as I do since your sorc level is much higher, but these things tend to wipe out my companion and/or do and take a lot of damage for the exp compared to lake monsters.
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MythrilZenith
post Jul 19 2019, 02:26 PM
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I'm picking up a new path, though not one without danger. The quick route through 3, the stairs + teleporters from 4 to 6, then up to 7 and chute to 10, and then straight down to 11 and a single Eth Portal to hit up the White Dragon. I'm not *too* old right now (floating around 28), but the sooner I can build up a stash of Dragon's Blood the better. Still haven't gotten anything, but I've only really completed the trip a couple of times because it's a bit dangerous.

I say dangerous because sometimes I forget that Levitate is only 95% effective and try to walk over the chute to floor 12. I have since fallen down to 12 at least once, barely getting back with 50hp after using up 20 charges of Crystal of Healing and a handful of Dust of Healing. I've also been spamming a bit of the Static Sash, and my Ring of Frost has been recharged more times in the last few trips than I care to admit. I'm getting plenty of gold, so that's not an issue, but I'm almost out of Static Sash uses, so hopefully I find another one soon!

Currently Witches are my favorite companions to grab on the go, as they both fight well in melee and have some pretty good spell potential with the Elemental spells. They don't like sticking around for very long, but they usually die before then.

My current panic-button target (that isn't a lava giant or dragon) is Phantasmal Mist. I can kill them *mostly* reliably with Acid Spray from my around-240 Sorcerer, but if I ever spot any when I'm low on spell points they put up a mean fight. Breath attacks PLUS the paralyze/drain combo? diablo.gif One ended up hitting me through my paralysis resistance and I lost like 300hp before I got un-stunned.

Also sick of getting horrible rolls on surprise FATE traps. Been reduced to double-digit HP with only a handful of SP twice now. Doesn't make for a fun return trip - hence the reason why the Ring of Frost and Static Sashes are running dry.

Minimum Cost PD can't come soon enough. I need the extra Paladin A/D and I need it bad.
Does anyone know what level Sorcerer PD hits minimum? (should be 10SP). I don't have the tools to calculate that myself, because the formula for spell cost relies on knowing some modifier numbers that I can't access without an editor file.

This post has been edited by MythrilZenith: Jul 19 2019, 02:42 PM


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Just an average nomad trying to figure out how Mordor really works.

I've also taken the liberty of recording some videos of Mordor: Depths of Dejenol!

Classics are classic, but never mistake nostalgia for superiority. When older is better, it's because it truly is, not just because our perception of it makes it so.
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fischsemmel
post Jul 19 2019, 02:59 PM
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Sounds like we're exploring about the same stuff now. Phantasmal mists are a huge pain, for sure. I'm surprised you had trouble with their paralysis though. I don't know if I've ever been paralyzed more than maybe 1 round when I have resist up. Lava giants and greymahs are my other big annoyances, though at least electrocute doesn't trigger unless they hit/cast.

What consumables do you tend to carry? I'm always paranoid a big stack of a consumable will get stolen so I try not to carry much.

The spell cost tool sticky in this forum section has an updated link in the newest posts that you can download. It lets you calculate costs, damage, and more by level, besides just being able to show minimum cost level.

This post has been edited by fischsemmel: Jul 19 2019, 03:19 PM
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MythrilZenith
post Jul 19 2019, 03:25 PM
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QUOTE (fischsemmel @ Jul 19 2019, 08:59 AM) *
Sounds like we're exploring about the same stuff now. Phantasmal mists are a huge pain, for sure. I'm surprised you had trouble with their paralysis though. I don't know if I've ever been paralyzed more than maybe 1 round when I have resist up. Lava giants and greymahs are my other big annoyances, though at least electrocute doesn't trigger unless they hit/cast.

What consumables do you tend to carry? I'm always paranoid a big stack of a consumable will get stolen so I try not to carry much.


I was surprised too. Most paralysis goes away as soon as it starts thanks to 95% resistance, but I just got REALLY unlucky that time.

Right now I'm carrying a healing item (a 10-ish use Dust of Healing right now), a Rod of Passage with a few charges (in case I get teleported into a walled-in section like the Demonist lair on floor 7 or the bottom-right corner of floor 10), and a Sphere of Entrapment for charms. I've combined up some bigger healing items over time but after having several stolen from mid-level monsters I haven't brought them with me in awhile. That said, I haven't really had many issues with items getting stolen since getting around 200 Scav levels, but it's always something to be careful of.

At first I was more worried about the 40 inventory limit on a single character, but unless I get buried in items from lower levels that doesn't seem to be much of a factor. I only ever hit that limit when I was questing for a rare mob in an easier part of the dungeon, like the Morgul quest on floor 4.

Edit: Oh nice, I didn't know there was a working download link, since most of the links here are to dead sites from 10 years ago angry.gif

This post has been edited by MythrilZenith: Jul 19 2019, 03:46 PM


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Just an average nomad trying to figure out how Mordor really works.

I've also taken the liberty of recording some videos of Mordor: Depths of Dejenol!

Classics are classic, but never mistake nostalgia for superiority. When older is better, it's because it truly is, not just because our perception of it makes it so.
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Roland
post Jul 19 2019, 06:11 PM
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QUOTE (MythrilZenith @ Jul 19 2019, 10:26 AM) *
Does anyone know what level Sorcerer PD hits minimum? (should be 10SP). I don't have the tools to calculate that myself, because the formula for spell cost relies on knowing some modifier numbers that I can't access without an editor file.

I use Seth's Spell Cost Tool, which you'll find in the downloads section. In addition to computing spell costs, it gives you the attack/defense sequences (plus extra swings) for all guilds. I use it a lot.

Paralyzing Death reaches minimum cost (10 sp) at guild level 311. Here are the levels for the other high-level Sorc spells:

Hail Storm 223
Sphere of Flames 259
Electric Field 313
Arctic Storm 351
Burning Air 369
Flesh to Stone 405
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MythrilZenith
post Jul 19 2019, 08:12 PM
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QUOTE (Roland @ Jul 19 2019, 12:11 PM) *
I use Seth's Spell Cost Tool, which you'll find in the downloads section. In addition to computing spell costs, it gives you the attack/defense sequences (plus extra swings) for all guilds. I use it a lot.

Paralyzing Death reaches minimum cost (10 sp) at guild level 311. Here are the levels for the other high-level Sorc spells:

Hail Storm 223
Sphere of Flames 259
Electric Field 313
Arctic Storm 351
Burning Air 369
Flesh to Stone 405



3... 31..... 311? blink.gif blink.gif blink.gif

...

I'm just gonna level Paladin for a bit and contemplate my life choices...


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Just an average nomad trying to figure out how Mordor really works.

I've also taken the liberty of recording some videos of Mordor: Depths of Dejenol!

Classics are classic, but never mistake nostalgia for superiority. When older is better, it's because it truly is, not just because our perception of it makes it so.
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fischsemmel
post Jul 19 2019, 08:26 PM
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You don't want to know about precognitive death and soul entrapment... laugh.gif

Edit - well I kinda take that back. Soul entrapment is lower than I thought it was, "only" 333. But precog, yeah, is nearly 400. It's word of death that gets really silly, especially for wizards. I keep telling myself that I will spend time as wizard later so I can cast WOD for the big guy. But I guess odds are in my favor of finding a cap of death (or three) long before I get around to taking wizard to 250+ for WOD to be usable in emergencies.

This post has been edited by fischsemmel: Jul 21 2019, 01:18 PM
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MythrilZenith
post Jul 22 2019, 07:59 PM
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Episode 46 is here: https://youtu.be/WJKJHHxNznw

Some highlights in this week's Mordor Monday episode include:
- Getting my 3rd death of the character because Will-o-Wisps apparently electrocute on spell cast, and not just on melee attack.
- Losing my only Gloves of Power to a Slime trap on 12, and only getting Boots of Levitation in return.
- Finding the Mother of Serpents without looking directly at a map.
- Getting teleporter-chained onto floor 13 and finding my way back safely without teleport.

So I tried switching to an Avenger for my Paladin leveling, but the extra .6 multiplier didn't seem to help nearly as much as I had expected. Probably because I'm an elf with mediocre strength and Small size. It helped guarantee that I kill weaker monsters that I can still low-roll on with the vampire fang (like Pandruns or Kyu's weaker than Hota), but for everything else I still found a way to fail to kill them somewhat regularly, and being back down to 4 swings rather than 5 was more annoying than anything else, as the weaker monsters that I want to melee down the damage doesn't really matter for but the swings do. Plus it leaves me 15 defense lower, that Fang + Shield of Def, which I REALLY notice.

I brought Sorcerer to 245 for 13-cost Par-D, but I still want 311 eventually, and if I'm hitting 311 for Par-D I might as well go all the way to 313 for EF. It's only a few spell points, but every point REALLY matters, especially when I might be casting it several times per dungeon trip. Plus the extra damage is much appreciated as well, especially on Acid Spray, which is starting to fail to kill things intermittently because of low rolls.

For the foreseeable future I'm going to be working my way up the Paladin ranks. I get +3/+3 every 6 levels for a bit longer, then it moves to every 7, then finally a long stretch of being every 8 levels until 430, with a second swing at 489. Not sure if I'm up for 59 extra levels in Paladin (especially THAT deep in) just for an extra swing, but it wouldn't be totally bad. I think that's where my leveling of Pally will end, though, if I even make it there.

Honestly, Fischsemmel's running of a Good Human has kept me on my toes, and given me a bigger desire to keep pushing deeper. I'm pretty sure he'll push past me and end up killing Asmo before I even get to 15, but hey, it's good to push each other to keep going, right? wink.gif


Edit: I'm also currently trying to get together some assistance for a small project that definitely relates to this character... Hopefully I have more info in the near future!

This post has been edited by MythrilZenith: Jul 22 2019, 09:51 PM


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Just an average nomad trying to figure out how Mordor really works.

I've also taken the liberty of recording some videos of Mordor: Depths of Dejenol!

Classics are classic, but never mistake nostalgia for superiority. When older is better, it's because it truly is, not just because our perception of it makes it so.
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fischsemmel
post Jul 22 2019, 11:01 PM
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Well the third death is a bummer, but the rest of it sounds nice!

It's SUPER long-term planning, but since scavenger gets a 2nd extra swing and those levels pay off for thieving ability too, it might be better to abandon paladin at the a/d cap and get the extra attack ftok scav (if ever). I assume the crit and melee ability from those paladin levels aren't worth the time unless you don't have anything else to work on.

While I'm moving faster in terms of the calendar than you are, it's probably just because I play a ton (until I move on tl another hobby for a few months)! I wonder how our ingame play times compare. I think I'm a bit over 80 hours now, iirc.
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MythrilZenith
post Jul 22 2019, 11:16 PM
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QUOTE (fischsemmel @ Jul 22 2019, 05:01 PM) *
While I'm moving faster in terms of the calendar than you are, it's probably just because I play a ton (until I move on tl another hobby for a few months)! I wonder how our ingame play times compare. I think I'm a bit over 80 hours now, iirc.


Hehheh, heh, heh (around 150 hours now) blink.gif

Granted, I started this character almost 5 years ago. I used to be a lot less efficient in grinding. I also didn't really have the best direction with the character until recently. And sometimes I just leave the window open while I do other things and then forget about it.

But mark my words I WILL finish this game on Gil'Thrialle! Even if it gets to the point where I can't play outside of my recording sessions I will still finish the game. Every monster killed is my goal, but at least getting Asmo and the Demon Prince would be lovely. I'm actually moving through these deeper dungeon floors MUCH faster than I expected. The initial grind to survive down to, like floors 5-7 reliably is so much of a slog that it feels a lot more intimidating than it is, but it feels like the difficulty steps between floors aren't *that* much bigger. I have the tools to survive now, and the raw stats of monsters are less intimidating. It's mostly resistances and offensive abilities (like breath attacks or electrocution) that I need to worry about now.

I'm fully expecting to be dead wrong when stepping onto 15 for the first time, at which point I may instantly die, but it looks like the worst of the difficulty spikes is behind me.


Edit: How much total EXP do you have in Sorcerer? I'm just passing 21 million at level 246 sorc, and I believe at level 200 I was working with between 16M and 17M total exp. I want to see just how much the Human experience rate factors into the endgame grind.
Scavenger at level 196 has like 8M exp in it, for a different reference point. Across all my guilds I wouldn't be surprised to see if I had surpassed 50M total exp, but sadly the game doesn't really tell me that information.

This post has been edited by MythrilZenith: Jul 22 2019, 11:27 PM


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Just an average nomad trying to figure out how Mordor really works.

I've also taken the liberty of recording some videos of Mordor: Depths of Dejenol!

Classics are classic, but never mistake nostalgia for superiority. When older is better, it's because it truly is, not just because our perception of it makes it so.
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fischsemmel
post Jul 23 2019, 11:22 AM
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My 203 scavenger is at 8.1 million exp.

And with 30 nomad, 218 warrior, 9 seeker, 203 scavenger, 177 mage, 200 sorcerer, I'm at a total of 37.6m exp.
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MythrilZenith
post Jul 23 2019, 06:04 PM
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Not bad, not bad.
I"m approaching 200 Paladin. My goodness it feels good to level fighter-type classes. The lake on 7 is still giving almost enough exp to actually level up, and a quick dip down through 8-10 is usually enough to finish the level, and sometimes I even pin before running out of SP! The downside to fighting classes is their higher Quest rate (which I suppose is meant to "balance out" their faster exp gain), but so far I haven't been quested for anything I didn't either run into regularly or have waiting for me in my Confinement.

A near-heart-attack inducing moment happened as I was returning from the dungeon after a trip. I decided to open a floor 7 Blackout chest despite having 0SP left, and lo and behold it wiped my resistances. That's not too bad, I figured, with my route not taking me through any Stone monsters and my fighting ability being proficient enough to overcome most monsters without issue. Plus I could always just run from most encounters. I had full Hits, what did I have to worry about?

Well, the very next step on the path (it was the land route just above the floor 7 lake) I ran into Kei Shumas. I missed my first attack, they hit, and they paralyze me. And I stay paralyzed. For something like 50 rounds of combat. I drop from 747 to around 300 hp by the time I *thankfully* break free.

So yeah. Note to self, never forget par res again. I'm seriously debating that Dalyn's Tear right about now, though I still hate the idea of losing dis/poi res, especially when some monsters are casting Leprosy. Though I suppose it's a lot worse to get caught without sto/par res than it is to get caught without dis/poi, and I can just carry around a Potion of Curing to make up for the unicorn horn charges. Plus it's only 3 defense difference - surely that's insignificant, right?

This post has been edited by MythrilZenith: Jul 23 2019, 06:08 PM


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Just an average nomad trying to figure out how Mordor really works.

I've also taken the liberty of recording some videos of Mordor: Depths of Dejenol!

Classics are classic, but never mistake nostalgia for superiority. When older is better, it's because it truly is, not just because our perception of it makes it so.
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fischsemmel
post Jul 23 2019, 07:21 PM
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You can actually run into any monster type (that isn't totally exclusive to it's lair like aboleth or butcher) in rooms they don't spawn in normally.

You've surely seen kyu groups in dry rooms ocassionally right? While very rare, you could find Medusa or mostrums or whatever in an unexpected place!

I always return to town with a reserve of sp, first so accidentally walking into an extinguisher or something doesn't stop me from rebuffing, second so I can hit a panic button on a nasty monster group, and third to heal before taking the steps, all without (probably) needing consumables.


Oh, when you were paralyzed, did you notice if it dropped your defense significantly? I never noticed before this character, but I believe I've been losing like 70+ defense while paralyzed.

This post has been edited by fischsemmel: Jul 23 2019, 07:28 PM
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MythrilZenith
post Jul 23 2019, 07:59 PM
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QUOTE (fischsemmel @ Jul 23 2019, 01:21 PM) *
Oh, when you were paralyzed, did you notice if it dropped your defense significantly? I never noticed before this character, but I believe I've been losing like 70+ defense while paralyzed.


I didn't think to stop and look at my character stats page, to be honest. I was too busy spamming the arrow keys and hoping that I would be able to run backwards once my character was freed before I got paralyzed again.


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Just an average nomad trying to figure out how Mordor really works.

I've also taken the liberty of recording some videos of Mordor: Depths of Dejenol!

Classics are classic, but never mistake nostalgia for superiority. When older is better, it's because it truly is, not just because our perception of it makes it so.
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Roland
post Jul 23 2019, 09:34 PM
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A few days ago my Morloch's Lamurian Warrior companion got stoned. A few minutes later he hit the Vampire lair. Despite having natural 95% resistance to paralysis, he was paralyzed by the Vampire. By the time it wore off, he was down to 20 hits! That was a narrow escape. That's the main reason to keep a companion around.

Not long after that, he blew four blackout traps in a single run. I ended that run early.
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MythrilZenith
post Jul 23 2019, 10:25 PM
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Did I say that the game didn't let you see Total EXP easily? Well I was dead wrong on that. As it turns out, it's right there under the Char tab.

At the time of this writing i'm at 48.5 Million exp. My entire guild stack looks like this:

Nomad (73)
Paladin (183)
Seeker (never joined)
Scavenger (196)
Mage (143)
Sorcerer (246)
Wizard (77)

... and that's it! Yep, Gil'thrialle has leveled in every guild available to her except for Seeker, and honestly I don't see too much purpose in that. The extra perception would help with mapping new areas and finding myself after teleporter/chute/rotator, but beyond that I don't find it that important, and any move spells I need I can still get at the same rate from Wizard.

I have 2 billion gold in bank, so my most limiting factor is actual existence of items.
My total A/D as Paladin right now is 281/339, and I'm increasing that over time as well.

I think it's really cool how the game lets you see and keep track of all of these minor stats like this.


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Just an average nomad trying to figure out how Mordor really works.

I've also taken the liberty of recording some videos of Mordor: Depths of Dejenol!

Classics are classic, but never mistake nostalgia for superiority. When older is better, it's because it truly is, not just because our perception of it makes it so.
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fischsemmel
post Jul 24 2019, 09:15 PM
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You might want to consider joining seeker even if you never go above level 1. I have more perception from 9 seeker than 200+ my other guilds.

Are you planning to actually level wizard up to be able to use word of death when needed? Or just some for travel spells? I can't remember if my osirri found a cap of death before I wanted to fight the big guy or not. I'm really not keen on 300 wizard levels, even as a human! laugh.gif

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MythrilZenith
post Jul 24 2019, 10:39 PM
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QUOTE (fischsemmel @ Jul 24 2019, 03:15 PM) *
You might want to consider joining seeker even if you never go above level 1. I have more perception from 9 seeker than 200+ my other guilds.

Are you planning to actually level wizard up to be able to use word of death when needed? Or just some for travel spells? I can't remember if my osirri found a cap of death before I wanted to fight the big guy or not. I'm really not keen on 300 wizard levels, even as a human! laugh.gif



The way that stats work, if I run Seeker at all then it's going to be the only thing I'm getting Perception from. Unless I've been misinformed. Then again, if the perception really IS that high, then I might be wise to get a few levels in it.
That said, most of Perception as a stat is just reducing the annoyance of the dungeon and the tedium of pressing back and forward on the arrow keys. It's nice to have for mapping purposes (and I suppose not getting lost on rotators) but not at all necessary.

I considered leveling Wizard, but it's a miserable journey and I REALLY don't want to have to level a THIRD spellcasting class. It's bad enough that I still have about 30 levels of Mage left before minimum cost heals. Unless I find myself in a position where I have absolutely no other choice beyond casting WoD myself, then I'll consider it, but I feel that if I had to dig myself into 300+ more Wizard levels I'd probably uninstall first.


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Just an average nomad trying to figure out how Mordor really works.

I've also taken the liberty of recording some videos of Mordor: Depths of Dejenol!

Classics are classic, but never mistake nostalgia for superiority. When older is better, it's because it truly is, not just because our perception of it makes it so.
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fischsemmel
post Jul 25 2019, 12:32 AM
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Makes sense.

I'm not positive how perception works, I know is my perception stat on the character tab comes from seeker 9 and not from warrior 238 or whatever.

Seeker totally isn't necessary, but then again, 50 or even 100 levels takes very little time relatively speaking, and seems, ime, to aid a lot with detecting pits/teleports/extinguishers or just finding yourself after a teleport trap.
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MythrilZenith
post Jul 26 2019, 02:22 PM
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It's interesting how many different routes I can run right now. I'm getting into a habit of taking the 7-10 chute as a shortcut to 12 to kill Mom, then working my way back to town. Then second run happens where I side-track through 11 to hit the white dragons. Then in my 3rd run I go my old route, killing the floor 9 vampire and floor 10 GK. And by the time I finish that third run, the floor 12 route is usually refreshed and I can hunt down Mom again.

In less happy news, I've burned through yet another Ring of Frost thanks to a surprise Slime trap. I think that's my 3rd one this character? Oh well, it was starting to cap out on usefulness anyway. I swapped it out for a Ring of Entrapment (which I had 1 Good and 5 Neutral in store, somehow), which should be a much more effective spell in general.

I found a Sword of Slaying, which (upon closer examination) just looks like a worse Vampire Fang with Crit instead of Backstab, limited only to fighting classes, one less swing, and 6 points moved from attack to defense.
I also found my first Lamurian Shock Lance (courtesy of Mom), which I sold to the shop, but for some reason isn't being stocked? It only had 20 uses on it, so maybe the shop has a higher minimum uses required to stock? Or maybe the shock lance can't be stocked, like the Medusa Head? Either way, I'm a bit sad that I sold it now. Not that it would be a *great* weapon, but it might be a decent way to bring down Mom without spending 30 SP on EF.

I'm about to ACTUALLY hit 200 paladin now, with almost 10M exp in the class. I'm still under 100k required per level, though, so it's going about twice as quickly as a Sorcerer level.


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Just an average nomad trying to figure out how Mordor really works.

I've also taken the liberty of recording some videos of Mordor: Depths of Dejenol!

Classics are classic, but never mistake nostalgia for superiority. When older is better, it's because it truly is, not just because our perception of it makes it so.
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